Martin Sokk

Interview with Martin

Could you share your journey with us?

First, imagine you have amnesia and have forgotten all aspects of your life. To remember who you are and the type of person you've become, please reflect on key moments, realizations, and milestones that have shaped your evolution from the earliest memories you can recall until the present day.

I think generally I'm a rather curious person, and most of my past experiences can be defined as a form of curiosity-driven learning. Reflecting on myself, I remember creating an interesting chart one day that was similar to what you are asking, showcasing the learning path rather than displaying the CV. For me, it was about demonstrating how the person progressed from one point to another, what experiences and realization the person gained, constantly learning and realizing that their understanding of the world was incomplete.

Curiosity, continuous learning, and personal growth are essential to me. Throughout my life, I have had numerous learning experiences. While I believe that the foundation of values and fundamentals starts with family, I have also found valuable lessons in various work environments, entrepreneurship, and business settings. In each place I have been, I have encountered one or two significant lessons that have shaped my perspective. One of these lessons was understanding that success is not solely dependent on individual effort. It's about creating effective teams, trusting people, and collectively making things happen rather than relying solely on personal actions.

Moreover, these experiences have shown me that the world is vast and full of opportunities. Many things that may initially seem unattainable are actually achievable if approached in a smart and incremental manner. This mindset has been crucial in my personal and professional development, leading me to where I am at this moment.

Did you have anything in your life that changed you completely? Maybe some event, realization, or thoughts changed the direction you go?

That's a tricky question. I believe that throughout life, individuals tend to navigate their paths in one direction or another. However, I don't think people undergo drastic changes after a certain point. Rather, I believe people adjust their course slightly, aligning it with their values and aspirations. In my own life, there have been multiple instances where I've recognized that I was engaged in activities that didn't bring me joy. In those moments, I made the decision to veer away from those pursuits and explore other avenues. Curiosity played a significant role as I embarked on a journey to discover what resonated with me, leading me to make adjustments to my path along the way.

What drives you?

Curiosity.

What is behind this curiosity?

I do believe that I have a genuine interest in various subjects and in understanding how the world and people function. Discovering new perspectives and finding ways to contribute to the progress of the world is what drives me. In many ways, you could say it's a somewhat self-centered viewpoint, as I enjoy acquiring new knowledge and gaining fresh insights into the world. I am a sociable person and thrive on interacting with different individuals, learning about their perspectives and how they navigate through life. If given the opportunity, I would gladly assist others in pursuing interesting endeavors and making a positive impact in their lives.

What is more important, the outcome or the process?

I don't believe one can exist without the other. If you have a process without an outcome, it becomes inconsequential. Similarly, if you achieve an outcome but the process was highly destructive, it is also unfavorable. Therefore, I consider both elements to be important in their own way. While the outcome holds significance, as it often carries more weight, there is a tendency to fall into the trap of focusing solely on the process and mistakenly assuming that progress is being made. However, without a tangible outcome, the purpose of the endeavor may be called into question.

Have you ever been in this trap? You're doing stuff, but there's no outcome.

Constantly. However, I believe it's crucial to consider both the micro and macro scales where you are operating. I aim to avoid focusing solely on the big picture and prioritize finding what I'm seeking before proceeding further. Don't misunderstand me, the process holds significance. It often shapes the outcome. But the process itself can become restrictive. Following a prescribed methodology may result in building something stable and proven, but it may impede innovation. Simultaneously, it is necessary to challenge boundaries to achieve quicker outcomes. This is a valuable lesson we've learned at Lightyear. It's more comfortable to focus on building things rather than putting them in front of customers and understanding their needs. It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking that the product isn't ready, that more work is required, or that we need to acquire additional knowledge. However, the sooner we present our offerings to customers, the sooner we can gather feedback. Customers provide insights on what makes sense, what doesn't, and what's missing. By doing so, we gain a clear understanding of what actions to take.

From the experience, what do you remember more, the process or outcomes that you received?

Yeah, I think that often when you have positive experiences, you tend to remember the outcomes. And when you face challenges, you recall the good times spent with people while working together. In the end, you start to overlook the difficult parts on a smaller scale. When you look back, you realize that you built or experienced something successful and memorable. So, you remember how things unfolded, and if the process had a significant impact on your mind, that stands out to you.

Theoretical question if you were to lose all of your businesses, what would happen to you? What will you do?

So, I believe it all comes down to identity. It's a matter of personal identity. When individuals fully immerse themselves in something and lose sight of their identity, it becomes a significant issue. This is a common problem among athletes, businessmen, and others. Personally, I don't see business as everything. I also have my own personality and my family, which are equally important to me. So, I prioritize three things: myself, my family, and my business. If there's a gap in one aspect, I still have the other two to fulfill my life in that sense.

Are you a proactive or reactive person?

I believe that in the short term, I may be reactive, but in the long term, I'm proactive. So, how do I approach it? Well, at Lightyear, we have to operate within the current climate and constantly adapt to build a sustainable business that makes sense in the present. Over the past two years, we have encountered many unprecedented global crises. We have had to react to these challenges and ensure that our business remains relevant. However, the journey of building Lightyear began long before we even signed the contract to establish the company. It involved building understanding, gaining experiences, and expanding our network. Many activities were done mindfully to ensure progress and success. This approach has proven to be extremely valuable in many ways.

I like to make a lot of decisions in a mindful way. For example, I carefully consider who my partner is and how I want to grow my family. I think about the long-term implications of my choices. When it comes to traveling, I never book anything in advance. I simply go with the flow. So, when my wife and I travel, we just fly to a country and then figure out what to do once we're there. We're happy to be spontaneous and explore things in these new places. I find enjoyment in the abstract nature of this approach, where things unfold naturally. I'm also comfortable with the idea that the world can change, and it doesn't bother me too much. Sometimes, this spontaneity leads to amazing discoveries that I couldn't have imagined beforehand. Other times, it can be a bit dull. However, I do appreciate having certain aspects of my life grounded in thoughtful decision-making. For instance, I carefully consider where I spend my time in terms of work

When you make decisions, do you rely on analytics and rational thinking or emotions and feelings?

Yeah, so I believe it depends on the impact a decision will have on your life and how it aligns with your values. Consider, for instance, the decision to have a baby, which has a significant many-year impact on one's life. Similarly, building a company can also have a decade-long impact. On the other hand, decisions like which car to buy, where to travel, or how to spend a weekend don't really matter in the grand scheme of things. They are short-term matters that can bring enjoyment or dissatisfaction based on personal preferences and experiences. I find the exploratory aspect of these less significant decisions quite interesting. However, in the long run, it's crucial to ensure that I'm investing my time wisely in both business and family matters. It's a balance between exploring and indulging in short-term choices while making sure I'm making sound decisions for the future.

Do emotions, feelings, or gut feelings influence you?

Oh, yeah, definitely. I'm certainly a more emotional person. I often base many of my decisions on my perception of where the world is headed and how it aligns with my own understanding. A significant part of this decision-making process is influenced by my emotions and gut feelings.

What makes you happy?

I believe it's about continuously learning and progressing. It's a process of moving forward, learning, and exploring new things for personal growth. These elements resonate with me, even though I may not fully grasp the underlying concept. I can see that they ignite my curiosity, keep me interested in various subjects, and ultimately bring me happiness.

Have you ever spent two or three days doing nothing?

Two or three days? Probably not. I can't stay idle for that long, but I have engaged in many activities that may seem meaningless. However, I believe there is a distinction between those activities and the ones I genuinely enjoy. While I occasionally find pleasure in seemingly purposeless activities, they are different and exist outside of a specific context.

How do you react to pleasant and unpleasant situations?

So I consider myself to be a generally calm person. While I do experience emotions, I tend to remain calm in most situations. Whether things are going well or poorly, my emotional reactions are relatively subdued. However, when it comes to other people's problems, especially those close to me, I tend to be deeply affected and take them personally. For example, if someone I work with or live with is facing challenges, it leaves a lasting impact on me, and I often find myself pondering over their issues.

I believe that emotions play a significant role in relationships. Whether it's working with colleagues, partners in business ventures, or my own family, the emotions I experience are heavily influenced by these interactions. If my wife is unhappy, it deeply affects me, and I become more concerned about finding ways to address the situation. On the other hand, if for example I break some item, it doesn't affect me as strongly.

In summary, my emotional state is largely tied to the relationships I have with people and the interactions I share with them. While I may not experience extreme emotions in response to personal events, the emotions of those around me hold significant importance in my life.

How do you understand the term "goal of the soul"?

I don't believe that we have a predetermined purpose in life. I haven't yet figured out the ultimate purpose of life. I often observe people who seem to have a clear understanding of why they are here and what their mission is. While it's fascinating to see individuals with such clarity, I'm uncertain whether they are truly in a good place or not. Personally, I believe that people's purpose is shaped by their interactions and goals in the present moment. This ties into the previous question you asked about losing one's job and identity. I think people can have various identities throughout different periods of time, focusing on different aspects and ambitions.

As for myself, I currently strive to divide my time evenly: one-third on building my business, one-third with my family, and one-third for personal growth. In the past, my focus may have been more skewed towards the business or training, and less on myself or my family. This balance is subject to change, depending on the circumstances and the evolution of my priorities. Perhaps in the early stages of life, we focus on learning and building, while later on, we tend to give back or pursue other paths. Once again, I believe that this purpose and balance can fluctuate significantly.

Why did this shift happen, why did you start to spend more time on yourself?

I believe that our sense of purpose is influenced by environmental factors and various other elements. Additionally, our inner ambition plays a significant role. If we engage in something and realize that our ambition surpasses our current achievements, we feel compelled to strive for that higher goal. Sometimes, we may reach that point and find contentment, but personally, I tend to not remain happy in the same place for an extended period. I constantly seek out new endeavors and pursue different goals, as I find fulfillment in the pursuit of those objectives.

Could you please share with us your inner wins?

Yeah, I believe I've come to the realization that there is no grander purpose than finding personal fulfillment. It can be challenging to compare oneself to others and their goals while trying to determine one's own path. However, I've discovered that I have my own unique perspectives, which can evolve based on various influences. I appreciate the idea that I can create my own world and that I don't necessarily have to conform to conventional wisdom or best practices. The world is vast, and people pursue different paths and occupy different positions. This realization allows me to embrace the freedom of becoming whoever I want to be. Unfortunately, I think many people fail to grasp this concept. They often find themselves following a predetermined path or feeling stuck in a particular position. In my opinion, startups provide an excellent opportunity to explore alternative paths and experience the fast-paced and unpredictable nature of the world.

Are you doing some physical activities or maybe some activities for self-expression, like drawing?

I engage in sports intermittently; sometimes I'm highly active, and other times I don't participate at all. For instance, I have been involved in ultra running, covering vast distances, but I took a year-long break from it. Additionally, I enjoy drawing as a means of exploring something new in my life. It allows me to tap into my curiosity and embrace learning. Another aspect of exploration for me is traveling to unconventional places where people don't usually venture. It fascinates me to understand the mindset and motivations behind the actions of those individuals. Engaging in these activities satisfies my curiosity and promotes continuous learning.

Do you sleep a lot, and do you eat a lot?

I typically sleep for approximately 8 hours a day. I don't have a big appetite, and I don't particularly enjoy eating.

What do you usually eat?

The things that others find appealing in terms of food don't necessarily captivate me. I'm not particularly fond of eating, as it often feels like a chore to me. However, I have recently become more conscious of what I eat, engaging in discussions with a doctor to explore ways of expanding my dietary choices. Nonetheless, food is not a passion of mine.

Did you have people in your life who influenced you a lot or are influencing you today?

Oh, yeah, there are many people who have had a significant impact on me. Just off the top of my head, there's my mom and dad, who have played a vital role in shaping my life. Additionally, there was a person I worked with at a large bank in Estonia. He recognized my potential and gave me an opportunity when I was just a nobody in the company. This experience greatly influenced my understanding of how the world operates. His name is Margus Rink, and he is currently leading a co-op bank.

Moreover, Taavet and Kristo from Wise (formerly known as TransferWise) have been influential in opening my eyes to the possibilities beyond building something remarkable solely in Estonia. They have shown me that there are countless opportunities and people to connect with in this broader environment.

What are your fundamental principles?

There are some significant questions at play here, such as the importance of honesty and integrity. Another crucial aspect is providing value, which often goes beyond what people initially believe they can achieve. Helping individuals realize their potential requires pushing their boundaries and demonstrating that anything is possible if they truly desire it.

How do you assist people in understanding their capacity to achieve more than they think?

It's a complex question, but I believe a significant part of it stems from the environment. When individuals find themselves in an environment where others are a step ahead, inspiring them to break boundaries and pursue new knowledge, it normalizes the idea of personal growth.

To illustrate this, let's consider the rap environment in the US. Many successful rappers emerge from the same street. The reason for this is that they challenge and inspire one another, creating a sense of normalcy around their achievements. They become role models, showing that greatness is attainable. As individuals interact and challenge each other, everyone moves forward incrementally, as progress becomes the norm.

Conversely, there are other groups of people who are farther removed from this environment and perceive these successful individuals as unattainable. They may impose self-imposed limitations and believe that they cannot achieve similar goals. However, if they realize that there are no glass ceilings and that these successful individuals are simply ordinary humans, they too can aspire to great things. People may have different ways of operating, expressing themselves, and learning, but most things are possible for anyone. By creating an environment where such possibilities are embraced, everyone can make progress. On the contrary, in a strict and rigid environment that restricts self-expression, learning, and failure, individuals are unlikely to move forward. Therefore, fostering an environment that encourages growth, exploration, and personal development is crucial for collective advancement.

You mentioned several books, are you reading a lot?

I mostly focus on science fiction literature. I enjoy reading a lot of science fiction novels.

Do you have a daily routine?

So, it's interesting because a lot of people have different opinions about routines. Some say they hate them, while others love them. As for myself, I'm not entirely sure where I stand on that. I can definitely function well in a structured environment, but I'm not actively seeking a job or activities that revolve around strict routines. I prefer a more exploratory and dynamic world. However, when it comes to certain aspects of my life, routine is necessary. For example, running a business or managing daily tasks requires a level of structure and consistency. It's important to find a balance between routine and exploration.

In terms of my daily activities, there are certain things I do regularly. For instance, I make an effort to have meals with my wife almost every day, and we have meaningful interactions during those times. Additionally, I evaluate the direction we're heading and identify the major challenges we face on a daily basis, but it's more of an abstract process rather than a rigid routine. I don't have a specific morning ritual like waking up, having a cup of coffee, and following a set routine.